I have been working on this dragon for three weeks now to get a nice smooth polished look to it… I want it to look as good as the art in angry birds. I was hoping to get some opinions from the Corona Community!!
THANKS [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 321286[/import]
i actually like it quite a bit 
[import]uid: 10379 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84281[/import]
I think it’s awesome! Keep up the good work! [import]uid: 13726 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84282[/import]
Really nice It will look amazing once animated!
Regards,
Jordan Schuetz
Ninja Pig Studios [import]uid: 29181 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84287[/import]
That’s pretty good Jake.
As far as “is it polished enough” a lot has to do with how your going to use it and does it fit the art style of where it’s used. Right now its really good clip art, but if you’re wanting something like the dragon in SKYRIM you’ve got a bit further to go.
But you’ve done a great job for that vector/gradient feel. [import]uid: 19626 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84313[/import]
Thats my style!! You explained it perfectly!! [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84315[/import]
I think this dragon is great!
If I had one critique I would consider sliding his tail down toward the hind legs a bit - it’s flirting with coming out of his back rather his behind LOL, but other than that I love the style - keep it up!
–Croisened [import]uid: 48203 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84322[/import]
Ha! Thanks @Croisened! I never noticed that!! [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84323[/import]
Just updated… [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84326[/import]
@jakescarno how did you make that drawing of the dragon?
Also our company looks interested in hiring you!
If you want to know more email me: sebitttas[at]gmail[dot]com
[import]uid: 17058 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84328[/import]
I have been working on this dragon for three weeks now to get a nice smooth polished look to it… I want it to look as good as the art in angry birds. I was hoping to get some opinions from the Corona Community!!
Hi Jake,
I think that you are asking for some honest comments on your work.
Here is what I think :
Is your dragon “polished” enough?
Well from a business point of view there has been a lot of games that achieved success with characters that were not polished at all.
If it took you so long to draw that dragon, you should leave it like this and move to other tasks -> release then improve your character for the next update.
Now, here are some other thoughts…
Is your dragon “polished” at all?
No, it’s not.
Your character doesn’t have any identity.
It’s not “lovable”, cute or charming. It’s not even a powerful dragon. The colors, the style, the execution, are “average” or below.
It’s not marketable. It won’t get much attention from game sites, forums, but you need PR if you want your game to stand out and sell.
So to your question I would answer “well, it’s an average dragon”.
Nothing to say against that, nothing to say for that dragon.
It’s just… a clipart.
Are you working on a puzzle game? Then I believe it’s “ok”.
Are you working on a platformer? Then it’s far from being good.
You were asking : does your style look as good as the art in angry birds?
Not at all. Not a second. I’m surprised nobody told you before in all honesty.
What can you do to improve it?
Don’t spend so much time on your character.
Work on your game, the overall atmosphere, the music, the feeling that you want people to get when they play your game.
Your graphical style will come from that research, not the opposite.
Also, you should learn more about character design if you want to reach the level of the great character designers that are currently working on ios titles.
Learn, study.
Don’t wait for your style to be perfect (it never will be) to release your game, but don’t think that this is “good enough” because it’s not.
You got enough positive comments so I believe that some constructive criticisms could help.
Don’t take it to heart 
[import]uid: 95346 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84348[/import]
Hey, Jake, MrMells has given you a very honest and great advice. Take a breath, and then read what he wrote a few more times, and then move on with your project, and then come back to it when you can divorce yourself from the three weeks you’ve already spent on it. You’ll be able to see it a little more objectively, and then you can decide if you want to improve it, or it’s okay the way it is (based on how your game has all come together.)
I do the same. I need to decide when I should call it a quit and move on. But I also need to remember to push a little harder even when I feel like calling it a quit too…
Naomi [import]uid: 67217 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84355[/import]
@MrMells Thank you so much for telling me exactly what I needed to hear!! You are absolutely right! I need to take a few steps back and look at the game as a whole. Instead of looking at a small part of the game… Do you know of any good books on character design? Also that Icon looks great!! Is that a dragon on his head? Did you draw that yourself? [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84442[/import]
@MrMells … I totally disagree with your “honest” comment. If your post had the intention to constructively criticize Jake’s work, you have failed. What you did accomplish though is you shredded his creation to pieces, while not contributing at all as to how he should improve. He obviously wouldn’t be here asking for an opinion if he knew the answers to his own questions.
Did you provide him with an example as to the meaning of “lovable” “charming” and “identity” ? Is he supposed to draw little red hearts around the dragon, make him smile and give him a collar with a name tag? What did you mean? If you’re going to write such an elaborate response I think some examples are in order, and if you’re so good in criticizing others art… would you care to share some of your own creations to show us how lovable, charming and full of identity those are?
Jake reached out to the community not to be confronted by a person who has no clue how to give an “honest” advice, but to get an opinion from the community he feels and rightfully belongs to.
While I agree with both positive and negative criticism, I think the honesty here was a bit out of place. I agree Jake should take what he’s got and use it to see if it fits the game/project he’s working on… and improve on it if he feels like it’s needed. Criticizing art is one of the toughest things to do, as we all see art in a different way… but let’s not start with throwing daggers at someones work
@ Jake - hope you’re moving along in the overall project progress you’re working on [import]uid: 10379 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84527[/import]
Jake
Thanks for the icon and yes, this is a part of my work.
Please give me an email address so I can help you better and give you some directions if I can.
nemensiris
Hi, nice to meet you.
So, this is embarrassing, you are just disqualifying yourself as a professional (or a serious developer who is always trying to improve) *if* you couldn’t find anything constructive in my comment and my tone.
You answered with emotions (poor Jack) and I answer with facts.
If your post had the intention to constructively criticize Jake’s work, you have failed
I fail all the time. Let me read Jake’s comment again :
Thank you so much for telling me exactly what I needed to hear!!
Yes. You are so right.
I am wondering if your previous comment took Jake closer to his goal?
Because that’s all this conversation should be about.
and if you’re so good in criticizing others art… would you care to share some of your own creations to show us how lovable, charming and full of identity those are?
If you are so good at giving “positive comments”, show us how this has given disproportionate behavioral changes?
You see, asking for proof is ridiculous. And I don’t even need to prove anything, especially asked that way
Help me understand your comment, I’m naive.
Should I understand that :
You have decided that it’s better to hide the reality to Jake and you truly believe that “thinking positive” is enough to help people to get closer to their goals ?
Or you were not able see that his work was not a second close to what he is aiming for (beautiful application + sales)?
Or you couldn’t get that my post was all about “moving to the next task, improving, releasing, making more sales, motivation” and that it was totally relevant to what Jake was asking.?
Or you are trying to keep the competition away from your field (are you working on an app with dragons inside?)?
But I’m probably wrong in all cases.
Tough competition
By entering the ios market, we are competing with some of the best designers in the world.
Being kept in a false reality is the best way to fail. And I don’t have any special interest to see Jake fail.
It’s called reality check, and it’s a good filter to let whiners behind.
Work hard, release, improve, listen to customer feedback, invest in your learning, apply, contact, market, etc… is that bullying?
If this is how you provide constructive criticism to people you don’t know, I’d hate to see how your advice plays out with the ones you care about.
I appreciate your concern. I was wondering the same about your “positive thinking” mentality without providing any sense of action and improvement.
Ok so you disagree with my honesty, and I can say that your lack of honesty made you think that you know what’s good for Jake better than Jake himself.
So, we disagree.
The important is what Jake could get from this conversation, from all the people that commented.
My post represents 5% of criticism in that thread, should we all move in the same direction “as a community”?
We both tried to help him differently and that’s great, but I don’t rate your comment as valuable to me. Nothing personal, really.
Jake reached out to the community not to be confronted by a person who has no clue how to give an “honest” advice, but to get an opinion from the community he feels and rightfully belongs to.
Does “the community” do any good if it’s building a false reality around you?
“a person who has no clue how to give an “honest” advice”
Is that a judgement? Are you competent for that? Show me your degree!
And… should I care?
Jake is serious enough to make his own opinion from divergent comments. By acknowledging that fact, that proves I respect him more than you do.
Don’t try to think for the others.
How can you know what is better than people than what they say themselves (read Jake’s comment. Again).
So :
Do I care your opinion? I could have cared because I am not against criticism. But you proved me that you are taking the discussion in the wrong direction. So no, I don’t care your opinion
Did I hurt Jake’s feelings? It seems not.
Did he get something from my comment? It seems yes.
I know I know, I’m not “lovable”.
Bu anyway I was not talking to you from the beginning.
We don’t need to keep on talking. You disagree, I disagree, “show your work Mr arrogant!” blablabla
Talk to Jake if you have anything more to say and I am sure (and I’m not trying to be sarcastic) that you will have something constructive to say to help him.
You are a pro developer and I’m not.
You are experienced in that field and I am probably not.
And we have different backgrounds = much more to share.
I want to know how Jake could improve his work from your point of view as a Pro developer (not a challenge, not being sarcastic at all).
I just like to learn from others. [import]uid: 95346 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84548[/import]
@MrMells - seriously? why are you digging yourself a deeper hole than the one you’re already in? I don’t think I’m getting you “wrong”… I think you come off “wrong” and this all clearly shows in this and other threads you participate in.
You seem to be bitter that others charge far less for quality artwork, all while raving about how good you are how expensive art has to be in order for it to be recognized. Are you kidding? Or are you trying to pat yourself on the back (because no one else will) while saying “one of these days I’ll find a sucker who will pay me a $1000 for a vector circle”
I’m not gonna go to the other threads and bring up examples of how confusing your responses are, but just like on other ones you continuously confuse and twist…
While your initial post is confusing at best, your second contribution takes the cake. In your initial response you basically tell Jake that his work sucks, and then you proceed to confuse him by telling him not to waste any more time all while telling him that he should improve on it because his work is neither marketable, nor everything else you said… then you tell him that working on his character is not important. I mean come on? Really? Do you seriously believe what you’re saying or are you just saying that because you have nothing better to do.
As a self-proclaimed PRO you should be the first to understand that there are different types of art and everyone sees it differently and its common (especially in the iOS world) to see a project where some sucker spent thousands on artwork and all that effort was dwarfed by an app created by a 12 year old with drawing skills of a chicken. As far as character development… really? A character (if one is in your game) is just as important as everything else in the game. There are probably hundreds of slingshot games out there that look and feel just like Angry Birds, yet Angry Birds is the only one that hit it off… why? In my opinion it’s the characters they have in the game, if not… why would they waste their time on creating stuffed animals, shirts, you name it with the angry bird character on it? Yea you may say branding… but in the same time you can brand something all you want, in this scenario it wouldn’t be possible without a strong set of characters.
So tell me how did I embarrass myself? Or did you simply bash me because I genuinely liked what Jake had to offer as far as his creation? I never knew that someone’s take on something (also known as opinion) could be taken as embarassing… I am not a professional, I like what I do and I always want to improve, learn and better myself. If you read my other posts I usually seek help not the other way around, and that’s because I know when to keep my mouth shut (something you should think of when you begin to bash others).
No one is hiding anything from anybody… I think it’s your paranoia setting in. I believe that those of us who responded to Jake genuinely liked what he was showing off… so bash us for it!
So stop telling me that I’ve embarrassed myself, stop telling others how much they should pay for art, stop telling others how much their work sucks, and take a look in the mirror for a change… because right now you come off as a bitter/hurt/upset (I don’t know which one, or maybe all three) individual who has no problem in telling others how badly their work sucks all while trying to reassure us that all this comes from the goodness of your heart and highly overpriced professional ethics you developed as an artist.
Ps. Stop revising your posts… this is what a fourth one? If you don’t know what to say at first better say nothing at all, or follow the old saying “put brain in gear prior engaging in a conversation”
… yup, couldn’t resist the smily face, that one was just for you… you like? [import]uid: 10379 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84558[/import]
@mrMells my email: jakescarano@gmail.com [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84562[/import]
Hey, Jake, if I discouraged you, I apologize. It was never my intention.
Naomi [import]uid: 67217 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84584[/import]
@MrMells Thanks for sharing your honest opinion. I actually agree with you totally. Oh and I’d love to get your opinion on our Cannon Cat icon.
@nemensiris Jake was asking for a comparison between his dragon and Angry Birds level of polish. Some people thought it was great. MrMells didn’t. And maybe he didn’t express it in a way to your liking, but I think he was honestly trying to help. So give him the benefit of the doubt.
Btw, if anyone is interested a wrote a blog post on this exact topic!
http://cannoncat.tumblr.com/post/15696909154/asking-for-feedback
@jakescarano I applaud you for asking for feedback. Most people wait too long or never to ask for honest/brutal feedback.
This business is hard, and it can be painful if it’s your passion. But if you want to make it big or get better you need to listen to the critics more than the praise.
This is something my partner David and I have had to deal with. He does the art, but I have to be honest with him if I don’t like it. And sometimes it comes across wrong and feelings get hurt. But I think we’re over that now cause it’s all about laying down some ground rules and setting expectations.
If Jake went into this thread saying, rip my dragon to shreds, I think you would have seen more critics.
With that said, there are lots of books on vector art and character design you can find.
Jake, I know you use Flash so I can recommend this book http://www.amazon.com/How-Cheat-Adobe-Flash-CS5/dp/0240522079
Here are some videos too: http://vimeo.com/16357456 http://vimeo.com/18234522 There’s some NSFW language and images, but if you’re cool with that it’s highly entertaining and educational!
[import]uid: 27183 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84586[/import]
Thank you so much Don! I may just change the name of the forum to that)… Because to be honest I have had worse… i have had people tell me “I don’t like it” and don’t tell me WHY they don’t like it. Plus of course if I look at my art I am going to like it no matter what… @Naomi you didn’t hurt my feelings [import]uid: 51459 topic_id: 21286 reply_id: 84588[/import]